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Holmdel Park, Bowdoin Park & VCP Footlockers - Brief Speed Comparison

by Bill Meylan ... (August 4, 2004)

 

In a recent article about the Saratoga girls, I mentioned that Holmdel Park (in New Jersey) is a bit faster than Bowdoin Park ... Several readers wanted to know how I arrived at that statement, and questioned its accuracy ... So I thought a description of making a speed comparison might interest some readers ... If you are not interested in statistics, you'll be bored by this article.

For starters, I found Holmdel Park to be somewhat faster in 2003 (compared to other years) ... As a side-topic to my findings, the course records for Holmdel Park are available from the Scullion web-site as follows:
 http://www.monmouth.com/~scullion/records/hpbtimes.htm
Nine of the top 32 boy's times ever run at Holmdel Park were recorded in 2003 ... since the records go back to the late 1970s, that's a fairly healthy percentage of best times occurring in one single season ... Viewed from the outside, two explanations seem possible, (1) the group of runners competing in 2003 was exceptionally good compared to other years, and (2) the course itself was faster for some reason (length change, re-surfacing, perfect conditions, whatever) ... Note: I do not follow New Jersey racing that closely ... but it would be unusual if explanation (1) above was the only reason ... I defer to NJ experts as to the viability of explanation (1).

Comparison (Using Three Races)

One primary method of determining comparative speed is using individual runners as references ... But to have statistical significance, you need a sufficient number of individuals ... Thankfully, the New Jersey Meet of Champions (MOC at Holmdel), the New York Federation Championship (at Bowdoin), and the Footlocker NE Qualifier (at Van Cortlandt Park) have a sufficient number of individuals that ran in two of the three races ... so a comparison is possible.

Bottom-Line - Here are the Results (for those who don't want to examine the whole article):

 Boys NJ-MOC = 10 - 15 seconds faster than Footlocker NE

 Girls NJ-MOC = 10 - 15 seconds faster than Footlocker NE

 Boys NY-Federation = 5 - 10 seconds slower than Footlocker NE

 Girls NY-Federation = 1 - 4 seconds slower than Footlocker NE

Comparing Holmdel Park and Van Cortlandt Park (5K) ... Table 1 below lists runners who competed in both the NJ-MOC and the Footlocker NE race, with the time difference (in seconds) between each individual's final times at both courses ... If you looked at just the runners who qualified for Footlocker Finals (Jonathan Anderson, Brittany Sedberry, Jennifer Clausen), you might think Holmdel is a lot slower than VCP, but you must consider all runners ... Remember - in general, runners qualifying for Footlocker Finals run exceptionally fast races in comparison to other runners.

Outlier Data ... generating statistical results (with better accuracy) from the time differences in Table 1 requires removal of "outlier data points" ... here, "outlier data" are simply time differences that are inconsistent with the majority of time differences (in general, too high or too low) ... A good example of an outlier data point is the time difference for Justin Scheid who ran 71.7 seconds slower at VCP than at Holmdel - basically, he had a bad race at Footlockers which is inconsistent with his typical race, so his data point is thrown out.

Even with the outlier data included, we are still looking for the range where most data points fall ... statistically, this is nearer the "median" of the time differences which is not the same as the average.  An easy way of viewing the data is to graph the times differences in a histogram chart (a vertical bar chart of ranges) ... Here is a histogram chart for the MOC-FLNE time differences (combined boys and girls, selected outliers removed):

As seen from the chart, most data points fall between 0 and -30 ... the statistical median is about -13 ... so using runners as references, that's the difference between Holmdel and VCP (for those two races).

 

Comparing Bowdoin Park and Van Cortlandt Park (5K) ... Table 2 below lists runners who competed in both the NY-Federation and the Footlocker NE race, with the time difference (in seconds) between each individual's final times at both courses ... Here is a histogram chart for the Fed-FLNE time differences (combined boys and girls, selected outliers removed):

The median of the data falls between 0 and +10 seconds ... So, Bowdoin Park (at Feds) was a little slower than VCP (at FLNE) ... by comparison, Holmdel was faster than VCP ... Therefore, Holmdel was also faster than Bowdoin.

Other Considerations ... experience has shown that runners are more consistent in performance when racing for their teams during the high school season as compared to an individual race like Footlocker ... The time differences in Tables 1 and 2 have a very large range in comparison to regular season races ... The NY runners had a two week break after Federations, and many runners may not have had serious organized XC practices during the break ... The NJ MOC was the week before Footlockers, and some runners may have been "tired" at Footlockers ... who knows? - maybe the pressure of team racing helps the majority of runners ... But clearly the number of "outliers" rise sharply at Footlockers, so that "noise" must be eliminated where possible to achieve accuracy in comparing races.

 

 

 

 Table 1 - Runners in Both the NJ-MOC & Footlocker NE
 

                                                    Footlocker                Time
                                                        NE        NJ-MOC   Difference
 BOYS:                                              ==========   ========  ==========
      CHAMPIONSHIP RACE:
  7 Anderson, Jonathan      12 CINNAMINSON          NJ 15:30.4     15:51       20.6
  9 Khadraoui, Mohamed      11 Paterson             NJ 15:35.1     15:22      -13.1
 15 Papazian, Bobby         11 PITTSTOWN            NJ 15:59.5     16:07       7.5
 17 Hughes, Gregory         12 NORTHFIELD           NJ 16:04.1     15:39      -25.1
 26 Pannone, Christopher    12 WHITEHOUSE STATION   NJ 16:11.8     15:52      -19.8
 39 Cavella, Carman         12 Turnesville          NJ 16:27.8     16:19      -8.8
 40 Popeson, Spenser        12 LINWOOD              NJ 16:28.7     16:29       0.3
 45 Kornaszewski, Paul      12 CLIFTON              NJ 16:33.0     16:17      -16.0
 48 Forys, Craig             9 HOWELL               NJ 16:34.6     16:39       4.4
 51 Laskowski, Conrad       12 MIDDLETOWN           NJ 16:38.0     16:25      -13.0
 54 Wyner, Jim              12 SOMERS PT            NJ 16:40.1     16:06      -34.1
 58 Geilich, Evan           12 BERNARDSVILLE        NJ 16:43.1     16:53       9.9
 64 Yersak, Tom             11 MARLTON              NJ 16:45.0     16:41      -4.0
 71 Lang, Brian             12 DUMONT               NJ 16:48.9     16:36      -12.9
 74 Bingham, Daniel         12 TOMS RIVER           NJ 16:52.7     16:28      -24.7
 79 Rowland, William        12 FLEMINGTON           NJ 16:55.4     16:14      -41.4
 81 Mclaughlin, Sean        11 MARLTON              NJ 16:56.0     16:34      -22.0
 87 Scheid, Justin          12 SPARTA               NJ 16:59.7     15:48      -71.7
 94 Whitt, Dan              12 Basking Ridge        NJ 17:03.7     17:03      -0.3
 95 Pisano, Chris           11 TOMS RIVER           NJ 17:04.1     16:03      -61.1
 96 Masters, Joseph         11 SOMERS POINT         NJ 17:04.5     16:22      -42.5
100 Hedderich, Justin       11 SPARTA               NJ 17:05.5     16:52      -13.5
114 Krowicki, Joshua        12 Hilltop              NJ 17:11.3     16:41      -30.3
127 Dennis, Robert          12 LITTLE SILVER        NJ 17:21.8     15:59      -82.5
130 Williams, Ryan          12 Milltown             NJ 17:24.4     17:11      -13.4
146 Goldwaser, Elan         12 WYCKOFF              NJ 17:35.2     17:05      -30.2
152 Redmond, James          12 MEDFORD              NJ 17:40.3     16:59      -41.3
      SENIOR RACE:
  2 Nettleton, Jacob        12 SOUTH ORANGE         NJ 16:56.2     16:38      -18.2
  9 Haines Stiles, Max      12 MORRISTOWN           NJ 17:12.2     17:09      -3.2
 22 Palmentieri, Alex       12 NORTHFIELD           NJ 17:33.6     17:02      -31.6
      JUNIOR RACE:
  2 Lagreca, James          11 HAWORTH              NJ 17:01.4     17:00      -1.4
 10 Bull, Greg              11 EAST BRUNSWICK       NJ 17:16.0     16:50      -26.0
 11 Catalano, Andrew        11 ELIZABETH            NJ 17:17.9     17:22       4.1
 28 Brackett, Justin        11 POINT PLEASANT       NJ 17:43.6     16:43      -60.6
      SOPHOMORE RACE:
  1 Bredeck, Greg           10 MARLTON              NJ 16:49.3     16:45      -4.3
  4 Cator, Michael          10 Ridgewood            NJ 17:13.1     16:42      -31.1
 12 Lamastro, Anthony       10 FLANDERS             NJ 17:33.8     16:49      -43.8

GIRLS:
      CHAMPIONSHIP RACE:
  2 Sedberry, Brittany      10 Beesley's Point      NJ 18:16.4     18:42       25.6
  7 Clausen, Jennifer       10 JACKSON              NJ 18:26.1     19:18       51.9
 22 Mckinney, Arianna       11 BLACKWOOD            NJ 19:07.3     18:58      -9.3
 26 Brogan, Leah            11 TOMS RIVER           NJ 19:16.7     19:26       9.3
 29 Heigis, Clara            9 WALPACK              NJ 19:22.3     19:02      -20.3
 31 Enderly, Erin           12 OCEAN                NJ 19:24.8     19:29       4.2
 40 Stensland, Juli         11 GLEN GARDNER         NJ 19:38.2     19:29      -9.2
 46 Smith, Amanda           11 GREEN BROOK          NJ 19:43.1     19:13      -30.1
 60 Bauberger, Jenna        12 OAKLAND              NJ 19:54.5     19:42      -12.5
 72 Rugge, Lauren           12 ANNANDALE            NJ 20:07.5     20:14       6.5
 73 Lynch, Meaghan          12 PRINCETON            NJ 20:08.0     19:47      -21.0
 74 Mcdowell, Robin         12 MEDFORD              NJ 20:08.7     19:33      -35.7
 82 Gregory, Lauren         10 DENVILLE             NJ 20:15.9     19:45      -30.9
 84 Crossin, Becky          12 ANNANDALE            NJ 20:18.8     19:25      -53.8
 85 Lipovsky, Carolyn       12 Edison               NJ 20:20.7     20:16      -4.7
 90 Wright, Vanessa         10 HADDONFIELD          NJ 20:24.5     21:08       43.5
106 Terrin, Emily           12 RIDGEWOOD            NJ 20:38.6     20:09      -29.6
114 Bissell, Elizabeth      11 WYCKOFF              NJ 20:57.0     20:17      -40.0
      SENIOR RACE:
  3 Gaffney, Meghan         12 PONPTON LAKES        NJ 20:18.2     19:53      -25.2
  9 Morro, Frances          12 STOCKHOLM            NJ 20:34.8     20:07      -27.8
      JUNIOR RACE:
   3 Miller, Lisa            11 PRINCETON JUNCTION  NJ 19:56.4     19:32      -24.4
   4 Barbarasch, Michelle    11 PRINCETON JCT       NJ 20:07.8     19:43      -24.8
   7 Don, Emily              11 CLINTON             NJ 20:35.8     20:05      -30.8
  10 Mcmillan, Emily         11 WALL                NJ 20:42.8     20:55       12.2
  20 Moreland, Allie         11 MARMORA             NJ 20:53.8     20:43      -10.8
  29 Rutledge, Sarah         11 PARSIPPANY          NJ 21:05.5     20:21      -44.5
      SOPHOMORE RACE:
  2 Van Alstine, Amy        10 MIDLAND PARK         NJ 19:48.6     19:49       0.4
  3 Duggan, Tara            10 MORRISTOWN           NJ 19:58.4     19:40      -18.4
 32 Watson, Tara            10 BRICK                NJ 21:22.9     21:08      -14.9
      FRESHMAN RACE:
  6 Chegwidden, Aimee        9 HAMBURG              NJ 20:41.5     20:06      -35.5
 14 Carbone, Heather         9 TOMS RIVER           NJ 21:00.6     20:47      -13.6
 16 Kennelly, Jacqueline     9 TOMS RIVER           NJ 21:04.9     20:58      -6.9
 17 Harms, Maggie            9 RIDGEWOOD            NJ 21:05.3     21:09       3.7
 23 Richardson, Elizabeth    9 OCEAN CITY           NJ 21:30.7     21:26      -4.7
		

 

 Table 2 - Runners in Both the NY-Fed & Footlocker NE
 

                                                 Footlocker                Time
                                                     NE        NY-FED   Difference
 BOYS:                                           ==========   ========  ==========
      CHAMPIONSHIP RACE:
  6 Lomong, Lopez       12 MARIETTA             NY 15:30.0     15:45.4      15.4
 11 Heath, Kyle         12 Farmington           NY 15:44.7     16:00.2      15.5
 18 Luka, Dominic       12 MARIETTA             NY 16:04.9     15:52.2      -12.7
 29 Tschirhart, Kevin   11 NORTHPORT            NY 16:13.7     16:01.1      -12.6
 35 Smith, Leo          11 EAST ROCHESTER       NY 16:25.5     16:42.0      16.5
 36 Mcdermott, Kevin    11 WEST HEMPSTEAD       NY 16:26.7     16:23.7      -3
 41 Silva, Andre        12 SELDEN               NY 16:29.6     16:45.4      15.8
 47 Stevens, Mark       12 PITTSFORD            NY 16:33.7     16:26.4      -7.3
 60 Buchanan, Bryan     12 Cicero               NY 16:43.9     17:08.3      24.4
 61 Deren, Michael      11 BLASDELL             NY 16:44.2     16:41.0      -3.2
 63 Gaedje, Ryan        12 REXFORD              NY 16:44.7     16:21.6      -23.1
 67 Butcher, Jimmy      12 Garden City          NY 16:47.4     16:51.8      4.4
 73 Gurzler, Jacob      12 BALLSTON LAKE        NY 16:52.4     16:12.0      -40.4
 80 Segni, Girma        11 BRONX                NY 16:55.7     16:37.6      -18.1
 98 Busby, Daniel       10 VESTAL               NY 17:05.0     16:36.4      -28.6
 99 Mccabe, Brian       12 NEW ROCHELLE         NY 17:05.3     17:18.0      12.7
102 Murphy, Tom         12 SMITHTOWN            NY 17:06.0     16:39.1      -26.9
105 Jamieson, Carlos    11 Garnerville          NY 17:06.9     16:26.8      -40.1
107 Santore, Stephen    12 CONGERS              NY 17:07.4     16:53.4      -14
110 Beaubrun, James     12 HUNTINGTON STATION   NY 17:08.4     17:19.7      11.3
112 Nicotera, John      11 Sauquoit             NY 17:10.0     17:15.7      5.7
115 Rundell, Trevor     11 Honeoye Falls        NY 17:11.6     17:22.3      10.7
118 Mindel, Scott       12 BALLSTON LAKE        NY 17:13.0     17:20.7      7.7
123 Meyers, Colin       12 WEST SENECA          NY 17:19.6     16:35.8      -43.8
125 Brown, Julian       12 Bronx                NY 17:20.8     18:17.4      56.6
139 Russell, Patrick    10 LOCKPORT             NY 17:31.5     17:18.6      -12.9
140 Rossettie, Anthony  11 CORNING              NY 17:31.8     17:04.4      -27.4
143 Gibney, Mike        12 WADING RIVER         NY 17:33.1     16:57.2      -35.9
151 Finnan, Brett       11 LOCKPORT             NY 17:39.0     17:27.4      -11.6
      SENIOR RACE:
 14 Perkins, Robert     12 LOWVILLE             NY 17:21.0     16:58.8      -22.2
 24 Dear, Adam          12 LOCKPORT             NY 17:34.6     17:44.5      9.9
 25 Perkins, William    12 LOWVILLE             NY 17:36.5     17:34.7      -1.8
 31 Stagnitta, Patrick  12 NORTH SYRACUSE       NY 17:45.8     17:08.0      -37.8
 32 Guaiquil, Victor    12 ASTORIA QUEENS       NY 17:47.9     18:02.2      14.3
      JUNIOR RACE:
  1 Arthur, Josh        11 TURIN                NY 16:56.7     16:30.4      -26.3
  3 German, Luis        11 Southampton          NY 17:04.3     17:16.6      12.3
  9 Truitt, Jonathan    11 LYNBROOK             NY 17:13.7     17:31.4      17.7
 14 Hampel, Conor       11 ROCKVILLE CENTRE     NY 17:28.2     17:23.8      -4.4
 18 Haskell, William    11 HENRIETTA            NY 17:33.2     17:20.4      -12.8
 20 Murphy, Bryan       11 ALBANY               NY 17:34.3     17:06.7      -27.6
 35 Pollow Jr, Dennis   11 RANSOMVILLE          NY 17:50.6     18:11.3      20.7
 37 Perina, Jonathan    11 STATEN ISLAND        NY 17:52.2     17:47.3      -4.9
      SOPHOMORE RACE:
  5 Treadway, Kevin     10 NISKAYANA            NY 17:17.7     16:47.1      -30.6
  6 Tolli, Lyle         10 LOCKPORT             NY 17:25.2     17:11.7      -13.5
 18 Lewis, Dan          10 STATEN ISLAND        NY 17:43.2     18:00.7      17.5
      FRESHMAN RACE:
  1 Rhodes Devey, Brian  9 SLINGERLANDS         NY 17:06.2     16:46.4      -19.8
  4 Haenle, John         9 LOCKPORT             NY 17:35.3     17:44.7      9.4
 23 Meixell, Tommy       9 TULLY                NY 18:28.1     18:25.7      -2.4


GIRLS:
      CHAMPIONSHIP RACE:
  1 Blood, Nicole       10 GANSEVOORT           NY 17:44.7     17:57.9      13.2
  3 Ryan, Aislinn       10 BELLVALE             NY 18:21.0     18:22.5      1.5
  4 Ferguson, Lindsey   10 GREENFIELD CTR       NY 18:23.9     18:30.7      6.8
  9 Lister, Nichole     11 Rodman               NY 18:31.3     18:34.3      3
 11 Cummings, Laura     11 BAY SHORE            NY 18:36.2     18:30.3      -5.9
 13 Junod, Nicki        10 Cicero               NY 18:41.2     18:51.9      10.7
 14 Crane, Shannon      11 DEPEW                NY 18:44.0     18:48.5      4.5
 17 Iatauro, Heather    12 GRAHAMSVILLE         NY 18:55.8     19:08.3      12.5
 18 Kubeja, Lynn        12 MENDON               NY 18:59.6     18:45.0      -14.6
 19 Mctague, Caitlin    12 NISKAYUNA            NY 19:01.8     18:33.9      -27.9
 20 Salamon, Ruby       11 SARATOGA SPRINGS     NY 19:05.0     18:42.3      -22.7
 24 Parks, Marie        11 North Syracuse       NY 19:11.1     19:19.7      8.6
 27 Sundell, Lindsay    12 FORT SALONGA         NY 19:20.9     19:38.2      17.3
 28 Vahanian, Cameron   10 GANSEVOORT           NY 19:21.5     19:00.4      -21.1
 34 Cundy, Fiona        11 ENDWELL              NY 19:27.6     19:33.8      6.2
 36 Cufari, Elizabeth   12 PITTSFORD            NY 19:33.8     18:55.2      -38.6
 50 Delay, Karyn        11 SARATOGA SPRINGS     NY 19:45.2     19:29.3      -15.9
 57 Hollinger, Andrea   10 Averill Park         NY 19:53.6     20:28.6      35
 63 Wegman, Roxanne     11 DELMAR               NY 19:55.8     19:54.1      -1.7
 66 Brown, Alexandra    12 KINGSTON             NY 20:00.2     19:46.7      -13.5
 71 Mattice, Amberlyn   11 SOLVAY               NY 20:05.8     20:36.9      31.1
 75 Carter, Brittany    11 SPEONK               NY 20:10.0     19:29.7      -40.3
 93 Smith, Joanne       11 Monroe Woodbury      NY 20:26.7     20:00.9      -25.8
110 Dwyer, Ashley       12 SLINGERLANDS         NY 20:48.6     20:13.0      -35.6
      SENIOR RACE:
  2 Trimpop, Danielle   12 WARWICK              NY 19:53.0     19:40.9      -12.1
  5 Prial, Becky        12 WARWICK              NY 20:26.2     20:40.9      14.7
 30 Millette, Jenna     12 WARWICK              NY 21:30.0     20:41.1      -48.9
 37 Hoffman, Ryann      12 BAYSHORE             NY 21:47.5     20:54.2      -53.3
      JUNIOR RACE:
  1 O'sullivan, Pamela  11 BAYSHORE             NY 19:13.9     19:27.7      13.8
 12 Laforce, Trisha     11 SPRINGFIELD GARDENS  NY 20:45.2     21:46.0      60.8
 18 Robbotti, Amanda    11 WARWICK              NY 20:52.4     20:33.2      -19.2
 24 Wlodarski, Caitlin  11 NORTH SYRACUSE       NY 20:59.1     20:58.1      -1
 38 Coogan, Laura       11 BROOKLYN             NY 21:29.9     20:40.5      -49.4
      SOPHOMORE RACE:
  5 Mangan, Audrey      10 HONEOYE FALLS        NY 20:00.9     20:24.4      23.5
  9 Nowak, Jess         10 ORCHARD PARK         NY 20:08.5     20:26.1      17.6
 16 Magin, Carly        10 DEMAR                NY 20:55.8     20:30.7      -25.1
 52 Grady, Samantha     10 Warwick              NY 21:58.2     21:46.3      -11.9
 54 Luke, Claire        10 DELMAR               NY 21:59.2     20:48.1      -71.1
      FRESHMAN RACE:
  2 Forrest, Rachel      9 ELMIRA               NY 19:58.8     19:42.0      -16.8
  4 Sprague, Cara        9 QUEENSBURY           NY 20:06.3     19:59.9      -6.4